Tapper: What happens if colleges don’t comply?
Maddow: Between you and me and all your viewers, I’m kind of hoping for that. We’ll drop the hammer. If there’s any hesitation, we’ll demand that they replace their presidents—just like the Trump DOJ did with UVA president Jim Ryan in ’25. We want to see responsible leaders installed—leaders who will honor the president’s executive orders and make the necessary changes. If they don’t cooperate, institutions will lose access to Pell Grants and federal student lending. If they have a hospital, we’ll suspend their Medicaid eligibility. And we’re going to have the IRS and Attorney General Mamdani go after the relevant university leaders, board members, and public officials.
Tapper: Won’t the colleges take you to court?
Maddow: I’m sure some will. But we’ll bleed them dry. The PR will be brutal. They’ll pay a steep price, and college leaders across the country will get the message.
Tapper: That’s a lot to think about.
Maddow: And we haven’t even mentioned the president’s executive order on gender-fluid representation. K–12 schools will be required to adopt California-style safeguards for gender-fluid students. Meanwhile, we expect every NIH and NSF grant to address implications for every element of the LGBTQIA+ spectrum. Any grant that doesn’t comply is going to be yanked.
Tapper: How would that apply to research on AI, green energy, or quantum physics?
Maddow: Jake, did I not say any grant? The president believes that identity is always relevant, and that we need to ensure no one is excluded. Look, any researcher who can’t or won’t figure out how to make their research gender inclusive just isn’t someone the American people should be subsidizing.
Tapper: We haven’t touched on Hillsdale College, which famously makes a point of not accepting federal funds in any form. Can they expect to be left alone?
Maddow: Oh, Jake, you’re a card. President AOC has made clear that there’s no room in this country for institutions that promote bigotry by clinging to fascist gender norms or right-wing patriarchy. We’re asking the IRS to strip such institutions of their tax-exempt status and the DOJ to explore avenues of potential litigation.
Tapper: You’ve also announced a couple of actions relating to the new school choice tax credit and federal funding for charter schools. What’s the story?
Maddow: As far as the tax credit, per the law, Treasury Secretary Newsom is crafting rules that ensure scholarship organizations and participating schools are carefully audited, don’t discriminate, and operate in accord with federal civil rights law. Entities that are out of compliance will no longer be eligible for the program, obviously. More important, they’ll be subject to investigation and appropriate penalties.
Tapper: So . . .
Maddow: If a private school took tax credit funding and then had students read white supremacist authors like Shakespeare, or failed to accommodate nonbinary students, they’ll be hearing from us. We’ll be looking to claw taxpayer money back. Remember how Trump went after UPenn over gender policies that were legal at the time? Two can play at that game.
Tapper: How about the charter school announcement?
Maddow: Oh, we’re just adapting Trump’s $7 billion freeze from 2025. We’ll hold on to those federal charter school funds while we ensure any outlays are legal and in line with the president’s priorities.
Tapper: Will those funds be released at some point?
Maddow: We’ll see.
Tapper: All right. Secretary of Education Rachel Maddow, thanks for joining us today.
Maddow: My pleasure, Jake. It’s a dream come true. And I just wanted to offer a huge “Thanks!” to former President Trump and all his staffers who helped make it possible.
